Diesel or Gas?

Choupique · Oct 14, 2023

Timsdually said:
basing that on the actual cost of the Cummins or maintenance?

Both. The gas costs dramatically less up front, a little less to maintain, and depending on your towing frequency some amout less to fuel.

jejb · Oct 15, 2023

Choupique said:
Both. The gas costs dramatically less up front,

And returns dramatically more at resale/trade in time.

Choupique said:
a little less to maintain,

If you pay a dealer to do routine maintenance, this can be a pretty good hit.

Choupique said:
and depending on your towing frequency some amout less to fuel.

This one is hard to nail down, given whatever the current price delta is. In the last few months, I've seen diesel be 9 cents more than regular, and I've seen it be 90 cents more.

18CrewDually · Oct 15, 2023

MPG differential of gas / diesel in what I tow cancels out that gasoline is cheaper at the pump. In actuality when towing diesel uses less fuel making it more cost effective.

ramffml · Oct 15, 2023

My 2 cents:
I would rather tow with a diesel.
I would rather own a gas.

Decide what's more important, overall ownership experience or power while towing.

Timsdually · Oct 15, 2023

Choupique said:
Both. The gas costs dramatically less up front, a little less to maintain, and depending on your towing frequency some amout less to fuel.

I would disagree on maintenance. Oil changes and fuel filter changes. No plugs, wires, coil packs to mess with.
I would also disagree on fuel. My last gasser got 12mpg, my diesel gets 17 mpg. In fast numbers, that's 40% better mileage than gas.

Choupique · Oct 15, 2023

Diesel costs 70% more than gas near my house right now at the cheapest I can find it.

The Financials for a diesel do not work out to the owners favor in very many cases.

jr27236 · Oct 15, 2023

Tulecreeper said:
If anyone is ripping through the mountains towing anything of any weight at 75 MPH, they're going to kill someone.

Yes, ME. Why?? Because if you don't hammer the down side, you'll never make it up the upside without crawling in the right lane. I used to drive semi's and you had no choice but to run the hills like that or you'd be a hazard doing 30mph

Tulecreeper · Oct 15, 2023

jr27236 said:
Yes, ME. Why?? Because if you don't hammer the down side, you'll never make it up the upside without crawling in the right lane. I used to drive semi's and you had no choice but to run the hills like that or you'd be a hazard doing 30mph

You're preaching to the choir, I maintained a CDL for 30 years before I retired. We're not discussing hauling 30 tons of cargo, we're talking about pulling a travel trailer or 5th wheel, and I still won't tow faster than 65. And only that fast out on the open road like I-10 between cities. If I have to slow it down to 30 MPH and stay in the right lane with my hazards on - like big rigs do all the time - then so be it. I am never in so much of a hurry that I'll risk my life to get somewhere an hour earlier.

HEMIMANN · Oct 15, 2023

Choupique said:
Diesel costs 70% more than gas near my house right now at the cheapest I can find it.

The Financials for a diesel do not work out to the owners favor in very many cases.

I did the financial analysis a ways back, it's worse now. Back then the break even point I ran was around 200,000 mile marker. If you tow full time, it still might not pay back below that.

That said, there is also the aspect of capability. Gas powertrains get worn down faster. And they're underpowered for heavy rigs and mountainous terrain. I'd go diesel if I towed often above 12,000 lbs and /or in mountains. Otherwise gas.

I had one of the 1st Cummins 5.9 Rams. I've since gone all gas.

Wyo72 · Oct 15, 2023

For me it was all about reliability. With all the emissions crap forced on diesels nowdays they just aren't the reliable machines they once were IMO. I drove a 2000 dodge diesel for 20 years and loved that truck but when it came time for a new one, after alot of research I just couldnt bring myself to roll the dice on a modern diesel. I do miss a diesel occasionally when towing in the mountains, but my TT is only 9000#'s so the 6.4 handles it pretty well. Now a 14K 5th wheel on the other hand I might be tempted to give a diesel a shot.

star_deceiver · Oct 15, 2023

Towing - 8000lbs or more, Diesel.
Maintaining - Gas.
Non-towing fuel mileage all depends on you right foot and geographical location. Lifetime, my Cummins got 1mpg better than my 6.4 did.

I’d be wary of the current Cummins. The valve train isn’t any better than the Hemi since they got rid of the solid lifters. Good luck.

4 2022’s 6.7 Cummins engines failed. How Ram handled it. And why I don’t buy Ram trucks anymore.

2023 Ford F350 6.7 high output Powerstroke. 3.31 rear end. Email:[email protected]: PD Diesel PowerThis video is only for entertaining purposes.

youtu.be

18CrewDually · Oct 15, 2023

OK, maybe I'll go to gas.
Who can let me try out there gas truck? 5th wheel required. LMK.
trailer empty - 8,200
Hoe - 17,900

I get 11.5 mpg towing this combo. Diesel by me is 3.97. Gas 3.25.
So what will your gasser get towing this? If it can. 7, 8 mpg? 6?

HEMIMANN · Oct 15, 2023

I get 9-9.5 mpg towing 6600 lb travel trailer.

6.4 Hemi, 66RFE trans, 3.73 ratio axle. 4x4 crew cab

06 Dodge · Oct 15, 2023

jr27236 said:
Yes, ME. Why?? Because if you don't hammer the down side, you'll never make it up the upside without crawling in the right lane. I used to drive semi's and you had no choice but to run the hills like that or you'd be a hazard doing 30mph

I recall back when I drove over the road at 101,000 lbs as I climbed the continual divide many times at 5 mph, I could of cared less what the other 4 wheelers thought as I was already driving on the emergency strip, everyone still had 2 lane to go around me, too me the only hazard on the road was the stupid drivers who jump in from of an 18 wheeler and then wanted to slam on the breaks, never in my life did I ever feel any one moving on the side of the road at 30 mph was a hazard, only the 4 wheeling fools driving around me...

BossHogg · Oct 16, 2023

Choupique said:
Diesel costs 70% more than gas near my house right now at the cheapest I can find it.

The Financials for a diesel do not work out to the owners favor in very many cases.

I don't know where in Louisiana you are but I took the city of Alexandria (mid-state) and looked up fuel prices using Gas Buddy. The prices of gas and diesel varied quite a bit but gas averaged about $3.09 per gallon and diesel averaged about $3.89. 70 percent more of 3.09 is 5.25.

Fuel prices vary a lot around the country. This past summer, in southeast Michigan, diesel and regular gasoline were about the same or a few pennies +- of each other. Most of the time I was paying less for diesel than my wife was paying for gas.

Right now diesel is running about 70 cents more than gas but I get 60% more miles per gallon in my 1500 ECOdiesel than I did in my 5.7L HEMI 1500. Diesel works for many but not for all based on your area of fuel pricing.

BossHogg · Oct 16, 2023

Wyo72 said:
For me it was all about reliability. With all the emissions crap forced on diesels nowdays they just aren't the reliable machines they once were IMO.

I'm not a wacko environmentalist but I don't have any issues with diesel emission systems, in fact, I'm glad they are there. For my lungs and my grandchildren's lungs. I only wish the EPA would crack down more on gasoline emissions.

As far as reliability you are right, in the first and second rounds of emission systems, they, the manufacturers, made many mistakes but in recent years, the systems have become very reliable. The system on my 2015 Cummins has never had an issue and my 2022 ECO, well, too soon to tell but I've owned it for 19 months without a single issue.

Think about all the off-road diesel-powered equipment like excavators, dozers, haul trucks, and farming equipment, all diesel-powered and with emissions that work. I have three pieces of land maintenance machines, all diesel-powered and never an emissions issue. I watch a couple of farming Youtube channels, their breakdown issues are mostly with harvester heads, never the engine or its emissions. Their complaints are having to add DEF or what they call "government juice".

jejb · Oct 16, 2023

Choupique said:
Diesel costs 70% more than gas near my house right now at the cheapest I can find it.

Already corrected. I don't think even in Kalifornia things are that bad. Maybe you meant 70 cents more than gas?

Choupique said:
The Financials for a diesel do not work out to the owners favor in very many cases.

Please be specific. How do they "not work out"?

For a DIYer like myself, the financials are pretty much a wash, in my experience.

nlambert182 · Oct 16, 2023

Same for me as well. I've had one experience where the cost of a diesel truck outweighed the cost of gas and it was a 6.4 Powerstroke.... think that's enough said on that one.

The CTDs have been extremely reliable and regular maintenance costs were fairly minimal all things considered. I'm actually in the process of searching for another so I can get out of this 1500.

Choupique · Oct 16, 2023

jejb said:
Please be specific. How do they "not work out"?

It's likely going to cost you more. If you tow a lot and neither one breaks, you might come out ahead. Most people don't tow enough and keep the truck long enough to realize that. If something does break on the diesel, you're way behind. When I did all this mental gymnastics a few years ago I already knew I wanted one and was trying to justify it. I'm sure that's what most people do. I couldn't make it work out. Our fleet manager has also told me that diesels on average cost him more. One failure is so expensive that it wrecks the numbers for the diesel and they're frequent enough at least for him to notice it. Fleets would be trending diesel if it was cheaper to operate.

jejb said:
Maybe you meant 70 cents more than gas?

I had my numbers flipped. It's 1.3x the cost of gas yesterday so 30% more.

KKBB · Oct 16, 2023

I always had a cummins and went hemi this last time. I only drive 1 mile to work, and 1 mile home. My 2016 cummins I did have was flawless doing this for a few years along with the occasional towing in summer and longer 30 mile trips to the city here and there. I figured I would eventually have emissions issues is why I went with the 6.4 hemi. Then I find out about cam and lifter failures. Lots of people recommending redline oil and short OCI. I do 5000 mile oil changes and use redline 5w-30...pretty sure the cummins is cheaper at oil changes when going this route by far. Overall, I like the hemi. It is nice to have warm air flowing in the winter in short time. There are plusses and minuses to both. Both can get costly with breakdowns. Just go with whatever you WANT, and whichever seems to be the best match for your needs.

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