Blackstone - used oil analysis

[ramffml]

In all fairness that was oil geek and not Valvoline and I have seen HPL in similar videos. So I give credit where it is do, HPL versus Valvoline versus redline companies doesn't mean isht to me, I appreciate formula and I do at least appreciate the oil geek video and just wondered if other oils will do the same in a video. If you ask me, it seams like Valvoline concentrated on a huge problem as in cleaning the bottom of rings. = very smart, Not sure how an oil guy would think this isn't cool stuff.

INSIDE Valvoline's SECRET R&D Laboratory to UNCOVER the TRUTH

Every engine begins building up deposits the moment it starts up for the first time. Deposits in the piston ring grooves can negatively affect the performanc...

youtu.be

How Race Oil Is Made - Behind The Scenes (HPL Oil)

In today's video we give you a look inside HPL Superior Lubricants plant. This was a cool experience getting to see how oil is manufactured from start to fin...

youtu.be

.

I'm not saying VRP isn't useful or that the cleaning ability isn't cool, just that I suspect it's a one trick pony; so it cleans well, but how does the rest of the oil hold up? I like a fully formulated/balanced oil. Why settle for "just cleaning" when you can get excellent cleaning + excellent protection + longer OCI's etc? That's all I'm trying to say.

 

[Hootbro]

I'm not saying VRP isn't useful or that the cleaning ability isn't cool, just that I suspect it's a one trick pony; so it cleans well, but how does the rest of the oil hold up? I like a fully formulated/balanced oil. Why settle for "just cleaning" when you can get excellent cleaning + excellent protection + longer OCI's etc? That's all I'm trying to say.

The oil is no slouch in that respect. Carries current API SP and ILSAC GF-6A licensing. They do not advertise it as an extend drain oil but it will cover any normal OEM recommend drain intervals. Does not have DEXOS certification but quite few other premium oils do not either as DEXOS while a high bar, it does not reward formulations that may exceed it and cannot get that certification because the oil makers do not want to pay GM the licensing fee per bottle made.

 

[Curmudgeon]

Multi-quote is not working as expected, so here we are as of the latest
stage of the process, today...

08/08/2024

08/14/2024

08/15/2024

08/22/2024

 

[Curmudgeon]

Results are in. This UOA is from oil/filter installed 12/2023, it is P.U.P. 5w-20 and a RP 20-820 filter and no additives. Also no oil was lost during this interval, dipstick had oil up to the full mark for the duration. No towing or load carrying on this UOA, just a DD.

Sometime in May 2024 I added 2 bottles of Red Line si-1 to my 26 gallon tank, the same time I installed the Moroso catch-can. I have been using only "brand name" Top Tier gas for about the last year, Shell, Sunoco, Exxon. I have drained the catch-can once and saved the goo, it was the last day for the PUP 5w-20 as I had the oil changed the next day.

Currently my truck is running Red Line 5w-30 with a Purolator Boss PBL24651 oversize filter, still no oil or gas additives. Also same air filter since 12/2023 since it has only run about 4000 miles. The engine is running so smooth and quiet right now that the cabin fan set on 3 makes more noise than the Hemi at idle. Neither I nor my wife can tell the engine is running. Even the radio antenna is completely motionless at idle. So far I am really liking this Red Line 5w-30.

Side note, I get a little noise from the left exhaust manifold on 1st start of the day. My oil-change mechanic confirmed when he noticed one bolt completely missing. He said he didn't mind tightening loose bolts but wouldn't mess with missing or broken bolts. So I'm currently looking for a better mechanic.

NOTE: The UOA at 528 miles. This was supposed to be PUP 5w-20 installed by my Ram Dealer, but it came out as black as coal. I no longer trust that dealer for anything. This 4000-mile oil came out a medium brown. I wish I had something more scientific, pics/video/anything. I didn't see this coming.

 

[JHoward]

Results are in. This UOA is from oil/filter installed 12/2023, it is P.U.P. 5w-20 and a RP 20-820 filter and no additives. Also no oil was lost during this interval, dipstick had oil up to the full mark for the duration. No towing or load carrying on this UOA, just a DD.

Sometime in May 2024 I added 2 bottles of Red Line si-1 to my 26 gallon tank, the same time I installed the Moroso catch-can. I have been using only "brand name" Top Tier gas for about the last year, Shell, Sunoco, Exxon. I have drained the catch-can once and saved the goo, it was the last day for the PUP 5w-20 as I had the oil changed the next day.

Currently my truck is running Red Line 5w-30 with a Purolator Boss PBL24651 oversize filter, still no oil or gas additives. Also same air filter since 12/2023 since it has only run about 4000 miles. The engine is running so smooth and quiet right now that the cabin fan set on 3 makes more noise than the Hemi at idle. Neither I nor my wife can tell the engine is running. Even the radio antenna is completely motionless at idle. So far I am really liking this Red Line 5w-30.

Side note, I get a little noise from the left exhaust manifold on 1st start of the day. My oil-change mechanic confirmed when he noticed one bolt completely missing. He said he didn't mind tightening loose bolts but wouldn't mess with missing or broken bolts. So I'm currently looking for a better mechanic.

NOTE: The UOA at 528 miles. This was supposed to be PUP 5w-20 installed by my Ram Dealer, but it came out as black as coal. I no longer trust that dealer for anything. This 4000-mile oil came out a medium brown. I wish I had something more scientific, pics/video/anything. I didn't see this coming.

View attachment 549258
View attachment 549259

This oil report looks good.

I'm interested with your next uoa of Red Line 5w/30 and that "rock catcher" Purolator Boss oil filter, lol ... I'm currently using the same oil/oil filter and still a little ways to go on sending it in for an uoa.

I've used the Purolator Boss PBL 24651 many times with good uoa results from Blackstone Labs. And, it's easier to "aquire one off the shelf" and is made in the USA.

 

[Curmudgeon]

This oil report looks good.

I'm interested with your next uoa of Red Line 5w/30 and that "rock catcher" Purolator Boss oil filter, lol ... I'm currently using the same oil/oil filter and still a little ways to go on sending it in for an uoa.

Me too. Well, it took me 8 months to run 4,000 miles so I'm not holding my breath on my next UOA. I'm probably looking at late Spring - early Summer 2025. I suspect we'll be looking at yours first.

Might be an apples-to-oranges comparison though, since your engine was dropped on it's head as a child.

 

[Burla]

Results are in. This UOA is from oil/filter installed 12/2023, it is P.U.P. 5w-20 and a RP 20-820 filter and no additives. Also no oil was lost during this interval, dipstick had oil up to the full mark for the duration. No towing or load carrying on this UOA, just a DD.

Sometime in May 2024 I added 2 bottles of Red Line si-1 to my 26 gallon tank, the same time I installed the Moroso catch-can. I have been using only "brand name" Top Tier gas for about the last year, Shell, Sunoco, Exxon. I have drained the catch-can once and saved the goo, it was the last day for the PUP 5w-20 as I had the oil changed the next day.

Currently my truck is running Red Line 5w-30 with a Purolator Boss PBL24651 oversize filter, still no oil or gas additives. Also same air filter since 12/2023 since it has only run about 4000 miles. The engine is running so smooth and quiet right now that the cabin fan set on 3 makes more noise than the Hemi at idle. Neither I nor my wife can tell the engine is running. Even the radio antenna is completely motionless at idle. So far I am really liking this Red Line 5w-30.

Side note, I get a little noise from the left exhaust manifold on 1st start of the day. My oil-change mechanic confirmed when he noticed one bolt completely missing. He said he didn't mind tightening loose bolts but wouldn't mess with missing or broken bolts. So I'm currently looking for a better mechanic.

NOTE: The UOA at 528 miles. This was supposed to be PUP 5w-20 installed by my Ram Dealer, but it came out as black as coal. I no longer trust that dealer for anything. This 4000-mile oil came out a medium brown. I wish I had something more scientific, pics/video/anything. I didn't see this coming.

View attachment 549258
View attachment 549259

For a hemi that is about perfect for a uoa except for tbn, not sure why it was so depleted at 4k, mostly city driving? Very impressed with those numbers, I would expect the first run on redline for wear to go up a bit. I'm not sure you need the redline, but that butter smoothness is addictive.

The 528 uoa looks like pyb or blend or PHM, if it was synthetic probably pp high mileage.

 

[Curmudgeon]

For a hemi that is about perfect for a uoa except for tbn, not sure why it was so depleted at 4k, mostly city driving? Very impressed with those numbers, I would expect the first run on redline for wear to go up a bit. I'm not sure you need the redline, but that butter smoothness is addictive.

The 528 uoa looks like pyb or blend or PHM, if it was synthetic probably pp high mileage.

Yes, definitely: city, grocery-getter, daily driver. Many runs are 9-10 miles round trip.

As for the Red Line choice I really wanted to get the Hemi back on a good 5w-30, and after reading through months of posts it seemed the RL was a solid choice even though it would be overkill, but it didn't seem to be overkill in a bad way.

And there are likely les expensive but very good 5w-30 options out there, but with 1-year OCIs I'm not concerned about spending extra for good fluid.

You're spot-on about the 528 UOA. Reading through the dealer receipts and speaking with the service writer I could only know for sure that the oil they used "comes out of a barrel", "I couldn't say exactly what it is", "synthetic", and/or they would give me a Mopar part number. That and the filter was always the little Mopar-0399 or whatever it is. The deeper I probed the more horrified I became.
The 528 was as much a flush as anything.

 

[quickster2]

Latest report. 5K miles OCI, 16 OZ Lubegard, RP 20-500 filter. PUP 0W40. This was with less towing hence the viscosity improvement. Confirms with this recipe if you tow a lot need to change the oil before 5K. At least for me.

 

[Burla]

Latest report. 5K miles OCI, 16 OZ Lubegard, RP 20-500 filter. PUP 0W40. This was with less towing hence the viscosity improvement. Confirms with this recipe if you tow a lot need to change the oil before 5K. At least for me.

What was the oil you ran at the 70k interval? Looks like that was lowest wear.

 

[JHoward]

What was the oil you ran at the 70k interval? Looks like that was lowest wear.

My guess is @quickster2 wasn't towing as heavy compared to the other oci's resulting in an lower aluminum/iron wear numbers?

 

[quickster2]

What was the oil you ran at the 70k interval? Looks like that was lowest wear.

PUP 0W40 with LubeGard. Started LubeGard at 65K. Less towing 65 to 70K cycle.

 

[Burla]

Interesting PUP changed it's formula to be di friendly.

 

[Hootbro]

Interesting PUP changed it's formula to be di friendly.

API SP spec basically drives most oils that have it to be "DI Friendly" for LSPI reasons.

 

[knightjp]

Latest report. 5K miles OCI, 16 OZ Lubegard, RP 20-500 filter. PUP 0W40. This was with less towing hence the viscosity improvement. Confirms with this recipe if you tow a lot need to change the oil before 5K. At least for me.

In the previous oil changes, were you using PUP 0w40 without the Lubeguard? If that is the case, looking at the report, I'm thinking PUP 0w40 isn't the best oil for the 6.4, even though it bears the SRT logo.

 

[Burla]

Even the 0w40's, wouldn't that be newer reg? I am out of the loop. Well the uoa itself hints it is a new regulation as the other two were not di.

 

[quickster2]

In the previous oil changes, were you using PUP 0w40 without the Lubeguard? If that is the case, looking at the report, I'm thinking PUP 0w40 isn't the best oil for the 6.4, even though it bears the SRT logo.

I started LubeGard at 65K miles. So.....the 65k sample is just PUP with Wix XP filter. Can't remember the "towing load" during that cycle. I've used PUP since day 1 with the exception of a couple of changes at the FCA Engineering Service facilty as this was my PE (Product Evaluation) vehicle initially when I worked for FCA. I bought the vehicle direct from FCA after I drove it since day 1 during the PE 1 year cycle. The couple of changes by FCA was PP 0W40 which I believe was the factory fill back then. Historically, I used the WIX XP filter until the 65K interval. RP 20-500 after. Always a 5K OCI even early on.

 

[BLUKTY2]

Here is the first Blackstone report for my 2017 6.4. The milage on the oil is very low for my typical use, but since the oil was getting close to one year of use, I changed it. Prior to this change I rarely went over 5,000 miles per change.

I have used Amsoil SS 0W-40 for about 30,000 miles after using PUP 0W-40 prior to this. Currently at just over 60,000 miles. Engine has no tick at hot or cold idle, but during this interval I did notice what I think is lifter clatter after startup for a couple of seconds and then it is gone; I attributed this to the lack of regular use. My first strategy was to add 16 oz. of Lubegard to the oil which I did at around 1,200 miles into the new oil change- absolutely no discernible difference. But this is why the Moly in this sample may seem a little higher than normal for this oil. My second strategy was to rev the rpms's to around 1,200-1,500 for a second or two before shutting down and this has helped cut down the clatter immensely.

As for my use of the truck, it works pretty hard and has since the break-in period ended. It carries a heavy camper and in addition sometimes tows a light trailer, about 1,200 lbs, around the roads of Alaska; no Interstate use here. And I drive it like I stole it whenever I can.

The main purpose of doing this UOA was to see how well this oil holds its grade during use. My thought and hope with using this "boutique" oil is that it would stand up well for my usage and stay as close to VOA grade as possible. I am leery of 0W-40 oils because in my opinion this much of a viscosity swing is asking a lot of an oil, and therefore at some point something has to give.

For all of the folks here on this great forum, I welcome your thoughts and opinions.

 

[Burla]

Here is the first Blackstone report for my 2017 6.4. The milage on the oil is very low for my typical use, but since the oil was getting close to one year of use, I changed it. Prior to this change I rarely went over 5,000 miles per change.

I have used Amsoil SS 0W-40 for about 30,000 miles after using PUP 0W-40 prior to this. Currently at just over 60,000 miles. Engine has no tick at hot or cold idle, but during this interval I did notice what I think is lifter clatter after startup for a couple of seconds and then it is gone; I attributed this to the lack of regular use. My first strategy was to add 16 oz. of Lubegard to the oil which I did at around 1,200 miles into the new oil change- absolutely no discernible difference. But this is why the Moly in this sample may seem a little higher than normal for this oil. My second strategy was to rev the rpms's to around 1,200-1,500 for a second or two before shutting down and this has helped cut down the clatter immensely.

As for my use of the truck, it works pretty hard and has since the break-in period ended. It carries a heavy camper and in addition sometimes tows a light trailer, about 1,200 lbs, around the roads of Alaska; no Interstate use here. And I drive it like I stole it whenever I can.

The main purpose of doing this UOA was to see how well this oil holds its grade during use. My thought and hope with using this "boutique" oil is that it would stand up well for my usage and stay as close to VOA grade as possible. I am leery of 0W-40 oils because in my opinion this much of a viscosity swing is asking a lot of an oil, and therefore at some point something has to give.

For all of the folks here on this great forum, I welcome your thoughts and opinions.

oil is built well as far as additives, you did lose a lot of viscosity but the wear is very good imo. That 4 alum hints at start up wear, just watch it if it ever goes up you can consider that. It isn't high at all, but in hemi's not known for start up rattle we see a tad less like 1 or 2. Just something to watch, iron and copper are fine, I expect copper to keep dropping. We have had guys move off this oil and have start up tick go away. Did you have start up rattle on PUP?

 

[HEMIMANN]

Yeah, loss of vis in so few miles is evidence for me to stay away from too wide of vis range oils like 0W-40