Lifter Failure / Hot Oil / Better Cooling etc.

[HEMIMANN]

So if you guys are ONLY interested in maximum power (torque) output, then you make a top fuel drag engine, right?

Blower, no intercooler (no time to cool air charge @ 8,000 rpm), nitrous fuel, and overfueling. Note overfueling is running so rich that a bunch of the combustion takes place outside the exhaust pipe, just like a battleship gun.

Why? It produces the biggest area under the pressure time curve! Again, the engine has to be built to take this overpressure condition, it won't last very long (fatigue cracking of parts), and it damn sure isn't fuel efficient!

But I thought these threads were for the average slob pulling stuff with a truck - not a drag strip motor (exception @Wild one , et. al.)

 

[HEMIMANN]

 

[Black1500Ram]

203° tstat for coolant, 197° for oil I’ll let y’all know how it does here in hot Phoenix

So if you guys are ONLY interested in maximum power (torque) output, then you make a top fuel drag engine, right?

Blower, no intercooler (no time to cool air charge @ 8,000 rpm), nitrous fuel, and overfueling. Note overfueling is running so rich that a bunch of the combustion takes place outside the exhaust pipe, just like a battleship gun.

Why? It produces the biggest area under the pressure time curve! Again, the engine has to be built to take this overpressure condition, it won't last very long (fatigue cracking of parts), and it damn sure isn't fuel efficient!

But I thought these threads were for the average slob pulling stuff with a truck - not a drag strip motor (exception @Wild one , et. al.)

thats definitely what THIS thread is about

 

[Wild one]

View attachment 545538View attachment 545539View attachment 545540

A top fuel nitro engine is basically a bomb waiting to explode,lol.

 

[Black1500Ram]

HEMIMANN while we’re on the topic of fluid temps, have you published any opinions on trans fluid temp?

Edit: see this is why you search

https://www.ramforum.com/threads/6-4-hemi-oil-temps.102086/page-2#post-2892867

Ideally I would love to change the thermostat to a 150/160° and still utilize the heater… but doesn’t seem like one is available without going external.

 

[Cum_in_s]

I prize both efficiency and longevity. Again - this is a balance of load, temperature, and lubrication.

Fatigue life is a function of load and number of cycles......which is a function of engine design. You're thinking about my posts about the Hurricane engine - or perhaps the the EcoBoost engine, where they didn't get the combination right - they ran it TOO hot for it's displacement and it cooked the turbo bearing oil and the compressor blades form the PCV oil mist.

That doesn't mean the solution is a 100F thermostat. Nor a 180F thermostat. That means the engine wasn't designed right - they learned from "customer field testing".

Anytime you push a spark engine past pressure and temp limits, you shorten the life.

Im not talking about any on individal engine in talking in general the the reason engines are built away they are is because of emissions not performance or efficiency. If it wasn’t for emissions thermostats, would it be set at 180°F.

 

[HEMIMANN]

Im not talking about any on individal engine in talking in general the the reason engines are built away they are is because of emissions not performance or efficiency. If it wasn’t for emissions thermostats, would it be set at 180°F.

Doubtful with as much is known today. People don't want to pay extra for gas to flush out out the exhaust unburned. Burning it in a larger 3 way catalyst is also a waste, even if emissions regs didn't require it.
Get my drift?
Throwing fuel away is only for racers.

 

[ramffml]

Doubtful with as much is known today. People don't want to pay extra for gas to flush out out the exhaust unburned. Burning it in a larger 3 way catalyst is also a waste, even if emissions regs didn't require it.
Get my drift?
Throwing fuel away is only for racers.

One could apply that argument to oil changes too, "no need to waste oil on 5000 mile intervals" right? But with the hemi we know better.

I fail to see the downside of running my engine at 90C to 95C (normal driving) or 110C (towing up a grade).

 

[HEMIMANN]

One could apply that argument to oil changes too, "no need to waste oil on 5000 mile intervals" right? But with the hemi we know better.

I fail to see the downside of running my engine at 90C to 95C (normal driving) or 110C (towing up a grade).

You don't have a variable thermostat.
And the stat controls coolant below 220F regardless of ambient. The cooling system is already sized for worst case heat.
Running engines colder than you can promotes deposits.

 

[Black1500Ram]

I guess I’ll see how much of a restriction this plate is… despite having m22 threaded ports, the orifice to get past the tstat isn’t comparable….

 

[Black1500Ram]

You don't have a variable thermostat.
And the stat controls coolant below 220F regardless of ambient. The cooling system is already sized for worst case heat.
Running engines colder than you can promotes deposits.

Well I guess that depends on what’s considered ‘appropriately sized’… allowing 240° coolant / 260°+ oil temps under any circumstances is not appropriate to me, and thus my side quest lol.

 

[Wild one]

You don't have a variable thermostat.
And the stat controls coolant below 220F regardless of ambient. The cooling system is already sized for worst case heat.
Running engines colder than you can promotes deposits.

An ICE engine is most efficient just before the pistons weld themselves to the cylinder walls,but by no stretch is that good for longevity is it now. If you stay on top of your oil changes and run good fuel,you're not going to have a noticable differance in carbon build-up between a 180 thermostat and a 203 thermostat,but the cylinders and pistons will be alot happier with the 180 t-stat,not only that rings will last longer,and if you bring oil temps down to 195/200,valve springs will last alot longer too,along with cam lobes and lifters. Heat kills valve springs,and the only thing cooling them is oil.

 

[Black1500Ram]

So I figured this was the gonna be the case but wanted to see for myself (stubborn).

With my current sandwich plate the larger filter won’t fit.

Setrab makes a remote thermostatic oil filter stand, seen here, but I haven’t seen any higher thermostat offering than 180°, plus I’d need another plate for the relocation ~$60, likely my lines I have are long enough, would need 4 more fittings.

So choice to be made.
Run the sammich plate I have with the 197° oil tstat and FE10060 filter, or, return it and get the Setrab one with 180° tstat and cough up a few more dollaridoos.

Ideally I want to keep the bigger filter and it would be nice to have it in a more convenient place…

I’ve sent Setrab a message asking if they make a ~200° tstat. We shall see what they say. If they do I’ll definitely go that route.

 

[Wild one]

So I figured this was the gonna be the case but wanted to see for myself (stubborn).

With my current sandwich plate the larger filter won’t fit.

Setrab makes a remote thermostatic oil filter stand, seen here, but I haven’t seen any higher thermostat offering than 180°, plus I’d need another plate for the relocation ~$60, likely my lines I have are long enough, would need 4 more fittings.

So choice to be made.
Run the sammich plate I have with the 197° oil tstat and FE10060 filter, or, return it and get the Setrab one with 180° tstat and cough up a few more dollaridoos.

Ideally I want to keep the bigger filter and it would be nice to have it in a more convenient place…

I’ve sent Setrab a message asking if they make a ~200° tstat. We shall see what they say. If they do I’ll definitely go that route.

This might be an option to look into. They have a 205 thermostat for engine oil.

Remote Engine & Transmission Oil Filter Mount with Thermostat

Patent pending remote oil filter mount features a built-in thermostat to save both space and cost. Internal thermostat ensures engine oil reaches safe operating temperatures quickly and prevents over-cooling. Inlet/outlet ports in standard -10AN O-ring boss threads. Optional fittings are...

www.improvedracing.com

Amazon.com

 

[Black1500Ram]

This might be an option to look into. They have a 205 thermostat for engine oil.

Remote Engine & Transmission Oil Filter Mount with Thermostat

Patent pending remote oil filter mount features a built-in thermostat to save both space and cost. Internal thermostat ensures engine oil reaches safe operating temperatures quickly and prevents over-cooling. Inlet/outlet ports in standard -10AN O-ring boss threads. Optional fittings are...

www.improvedracing.com

Yeah I saw that one but it’s $300+ vs $167 for the same functioning product with smaller inlet/outlet ports … hard pass

I have a feeling all these 180° tstats may actually by start to open at 180°, fully open by 200°

 

[Wild one]

Yeah but it’s $300+ vs $167

Modding an oiling system,isn't the time to be cheap,lol. Doing it right the first time,saves you money and headaches in the long run

 

[Black1500Ram]

Both billet pieces and arguably Setrab is the better brand name in the oil industry… no reason that peace needs to be $308 IMO

 

[Wild one]

Yeah I saw that one but it’s $300+ vs $167 for the same functioning product with smaller inlet/outlet ports … hard pass

I have a feeling all these 180° tstats may actually by start to open at 180°, fully open by 200°

I can run my truck wide open for well in excess of 5 miles and never see oil temps above 205 with my dual filter set-up and a 180 t-stat,and that's at speeds well in excess of 150 mph,even on several back to back nitrous dragstrip passes,it'll never get over 205 degree oil temps. Might be something to look into,instead of plumbing in an oil cooler.

 

[Wild one]

Both billet pieces and arguably Setrab is the better brand name in the oil industry… no reason that peace needs to be $308 IMO

I wouldn't say they're any better then Improved Racing's stuff,lol.I know of lots of guys running Improved Racings stuff,but i don't know of anybody running Setrab's stuff. Throw in the fact you're having a hell'va time making the setrab stuff work,improved racings stuff,starts to look better.
That engine adapter you have,doesn't impress me much that's for sure.

 

[Black1500Ram]

I wouldn't say they're any better then Improved Racing's stuff,lol.I know of lots of guys running Improved Racings stuff,but i don't know of anybody running Setrab's stuff. Throw in the fact you're having a hell'va time making the setrab stuff work,improved racings stuff,starts to look better.
That engine adapter you have,doesn't impress me much that's for sure.

Yeah agreed about the current one… it’s not a Setrab part.. it’s a Mocal brand that I actually got from improved.

Not saying improveds branded stuff is bad by any means… just over priced. And I’m frugalAF

We shall see where this goes.