Synthetic Oil

[Travis8352]

You are thinking about pulling the lifters with no misfire, if so please dont lets talk. If it is hot and you tow, like tj said 5w40 redline, with even a 15w40 redline as an option, but lets shelf that for now. In the end, TJ is on point, really 5w30 or 5w40 redline is their best two oils for this proven by guys like tj and hemif395 and U$A and others. 5w30 red;line is thicker then Mopar pup 0w40 for most of the interval, it is the closest oil to hemi spec. So to verify, 500 miles after an oil change = no tick, but then it ticks? If so kinda good news, I would expect the redline strategy to work, but keep in mind sometimes out of the gate it wont, not to worry science of EP additives. Before we get off in weeds, make your move. How about filters, very important with these hemi's, fram endurance fe2, or fram ultra xg2, and a newer option puro boss i'm sure someone can hook you up with the number if you want that. the RP 20-820 is hard to find, many of us that is first choice, maybe in the future they will stock it.

I would avoid the 15w40 redline as its a completely different formula than the other redlines. No moly, boron, or magnesium but it has similar zddp

 

[Burla]

Yeah, imo that would have been the last play, as in his issue is losing viscosity and not additives. So the 15w40 would keep that very thick visc with more stability then the garbage 0w40 redline. Thinking about it I kinda like starting at 5w30 redline, because then it is something he could always drain a couple qrts off and put back 5w40 if needed, seeing his specific issue of 500 miles no tick, but then tick comes on. It is more proof there are two types of ticks and they are polar opposite, ticks that like additives are noisy first then go quiet, ticks that are viscosity ticks are quiet first then go noisy. So one tick additive packages most important, other tick viscosity is more important, but it seams like redline's pao/ester base always part of the good answer to either of these ticks that we have examples of both.

 

[Burla]

How is this for customer satisfaction, in the largest study of it's kind, 46% of EV owners are wait for it.... going back to gas cars, lmao?

report

 

[Hemi395]

How is this for customer satisfaction, in the largest study of it's kind, 46% of EV owners are wait for it.... going back to gas cars, lmao?

report

Who wouldn't want to spend 50k minimum on a vehicle that locks you inside to be broiled on a hot day, has limited range, is a potential fire hazard that most fire depts won't touch and will let burn to the ground, and that takes hours to recharge??

I mean sign me up!

 

[Burla]

46% said they are going back, 54% are liars.

 

[Tony Donato]

Yeah, imo that would have been the last play, as in his issue is losing viscosity and not additives. So the 15w40 would keep that very thick visc with more stability then the garbage 0w40 redline. Thinking about it I kinda like starting at 5w30 redline, because then it is something he could always drain a couple qrts off and put back 5w40 if needed, seeing his specific issue of 500 miles no tick, but then tick comes on. It is more proof there are two types of ticks and they are polar opposite, ticks that like additives are noisy first then go quiet, ticks that are viscosity ticks are quiet first then go noisy. So one tick additive packages most important, other tick viscosity is more important, but it seams like redline's pao/ester base always part of the good answer to either of these ticks that we have examples of both.

Personally, I don't believe Red Line 0W-40 is garbage. I just think Red Line used overly thin base oils in it and lots of olefin-based viscosity improvers. Red Line also uses an SL-era additive package in 0W-40 that they top-treat. It's not a Euro ACEA A3/B4 add pack. It's good oil, just maybe not ideal for HEMI applications.
Looking at all the great work you guys did on figuring out the HEMI tick, I've come to the conclusion that two things kill the tick:

1. Additive package - that's why Lubegard Bio-Tech works in some cases where the second reason doesn't play a big role.
2. Film strength - Red Line 5W-30 has awesome film strength. It's the one oil where Red Line doesn't use any VII at all. They use 1-dodecene PAO and mPAO to blend this oil. Realistically speaking, it's a smart way to do it because mPAO is actually less expensive than something like star-polymers, and it's more effective. The downside is a lesser pour point. So you get better NOACK and virtually no shear, but you lose some of that cold flow. More proof that every motor oil is a compromise of properties.

AMSOIL 0W-40 has worked well for @Hemi395, and for good reason. It's got very good film strength. AMSOIL uses their most advanced mid-SAPS non-Euro additive package in that oil. Honestly, I think that AMSOIL SS 0W-40 would perform well in Euro applications. AMSOIL SS 0W-40 is not an energy-conserving oil, so the HTHS is 3.76, which is plenty to absorb any tolerance-related noise from the lifters.
I also believe that when @Hemi395 went back to AMSOIL SS 5W-30 and started experiencing the HEMI tick again after a few hundred miles, it was due to two reasons:

1. The AMSOIL SS 5W-30 is an energy-conserving oil, so film strength isn't great. With an HTHS of 3.11 (less than 3.5), it's nowhere near Red Line 5W-30 or AMSOIL SS 0W-40. It can take a few hundred miles for it to shear down and for that HTHS to drop well under 3.0, maybe to 2.7~2.8. That can cause the ticking to come back.
2. AMSOIL SS has very good solvency and detergency. We know that lots of Moly in motor oil can create deposits. I've seen some of you guys call it "plating," but it's probably the same thing. Most of the time they're not desirable for obvious reasons. However, in the case of the HEMI lifters, I think they are. I believe that AMSOIL SS dissolves those Moly deposits, and that's why the ticking returns. However, when AMSOIL SS 0W-40 is used, the ticking is kept at bay. Then, when Red Line 5W-30 is used again after AMSOIL SS 5W-30, it takes a few hundred miles for the ticking to go away because it takes time for the Moly deposits to build back up.

At least, that's my understanding of the science behind it, thanks to the work and experimentation you guys did here over the years. This thread is incredibly long.

 

[ConorToot]

My 2012 1500 4.7L has over 200k miles. I switched to Royal Purple due to advice from a trusted friend. Man, he was sure right. The engine feels like it wants to go now and never had before. I've run RP for three changes and I change it early because it comes out midnight black from all of the sludge it's removing. I'm really glad I did it and I'll keep flushing the oil until it stabilizes and starts retaining the translucence that it has when it's new.
Of all of the things that I've done to this truck to repair, upgrade, and improve the condition of it, this has to be the easiest. Stop going g to the 5 minute oil change shack where they pour garbage into the engine that's probably worse than what they drain out, use a good oil filter and switch to Royal Purple. Other than that change leveling the truck by lowering the back 3" and changing my shocks to some nice Rancho 5100, the oil switch has made a remarkable difference in how well it runs.

 

[fitteenhundred]

He finally reposted this video.

What BOOST Did To Our 5W-30 Motor Oil...

What does boost do to your oil? Let's visit @EFIUniversity1 to do some dyno testing and take some used oil samples for analysis. After our last visit to EFI ...

youtu.be

 

[Burla]

He finally reposted this video.

What BOOST Did To Our 5W-30 Motor Oil...

What does boost do to your oil? Let's visit @EFIUniversity1 to do some dyno testing and take some used oil samples for analysis. After our last visit to EFI ...

youtu.be

Proves ton about low viscosity and wear? It does to me. Under twenty runs, so what is that less then 5 miles? Devils advocate would say the last run was much higher rpm, so it would lean to not proven the point.

 

[Wild one]

Proves ton about low viscosity and wear? It does to me. Under twenty runs, so what is that less then 5 miles? Devils advocate would say the last run was much higher rpm, so it would lean to not proven the point.

He doesn't mention anything about the fuel being used,which i found a bit odd. I'm guessing when it was N/A and low boost they were running it on pump fuel,and once they went to 20+ psi they were probably running 110+ fuel.I'd really like to see that test done with comparable fuels,and to really mix it up,throw E85 into the mix.as it's common knowledge E85 destroys oil in a hurry

 

[JHoward]

... @Burla, (Mike) ...

I remember you posted that you use an extra quart(eight total)of oil and I can't remember how long you have been running your HEMI on the extra quart and and if there were any problems?

I've run my HEMI, on the last and current oci's, 7 1/2 quarts with no issues and am considering running full eight quarts, just because, lol.

Thanks,
Jay-Dub

 

[Burla]

It was never my intent persay, but I believe my dip stick to be off because for my truck it takes 8 quarts read full. My first couple changes were done by dealer and they had it full, so I have ran 8 quarts for 15 years, no issues. I was really just following what the dealer was doing as their changes always read full to the line. So is my oil pan somehow taking more? I think not, it is possible, but my guess is the dipstick isn't seated correctly, and I have gotten away with 8 quarts.

 

[JHoward]

Well, the extra quart in that case ain't gonna hurt anything, imo.

Most likely, an beneficial thing.

 

[JHoward]

... I've been over at the BOB's the oil guru folks earlier today reading the posts.

Man, I had developed an migraine.

 

[Tony Donato]

My 2012 1500 4.7L has over 200k miles. I switched to Royal Purple due to advice from a trusted friend. Man, he was sure right. The engine feels like it wants to go now and never had before. I've run RP for three changes and I change it early because it comes out midnight black from all of the sludge it's removing. I'm really glad I did it and I'll keep flushing the oil until it stabilizes and starts retaining the translucence that it has when it's new.
Of all of the things that I've done to this truck to repair, upgrade, and improve the condition of it, this has to be the easiest. Stop going g to the 5 minute oil change shack where they pour garbage into the engine that's probably worse than what they drain out, use a good oil filter and switch to Royal Purple. Other than that change leveling the truck by lowering the back 3" and changing my shocks to some nice Rancho 5100, the oil switch has made a remarkable difference in how well it runs.

Royal Purple is good oil. I haven't used it in years because I have no reason to. Their best stuff are the HPS and High Mileage oils. The Royal Purple oil sold at Walmart is API licensed, and it's like any other motor oil.

If you want something that cleans, I suggest you try Valvoline Restore & Protect. Afton Chemical formulated the additive package for Valvoline. Initially it was meant to be a long drain interval motor oil, because Valvoline doesn't advertise one in their portfolio. However, during engine testing in their lab, Valvoline discovered that this new additive package removes old carbon deposits and sludge. Valvoline tweaked the formulation so that it won't overwhelm the oil filter when it cleans. It takes three to four oil changes at normal oil change intervals to completely clean an engine with it.

Walmart has the cheapest price for it, and I would go straight for the 5W-30: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Valvoline-Restore-Protect-Full-Synthetic-Motor-Oil-SAE-5W-30/5000131742

... I've been over at the BOB's the oil guru folks earlier today reading the posts.

Man, I had developed an migraine.

Fwiw, stay away from those folks.

That place is a business that brings in very good money for the owner. It's also a monument to his ego. That's the sole reason it is the way it is.

 

[JHoward]

"That place is a business that brings in very good money for the owner. It's also a monument to his ego. That's the sole reason it is the way it is."

Yep, absolutely.

 

[ConorToot]

@JHoward - Thanks for the information. I've been using the high mileage stuff and when I buy it, I make sure to buy direct because you never know who might be licensing a lesser product that's "good enough" to put in a bottle and slap a label on it. It kills me to pay more for a name brand part, only to see it arrive in a box with the right logo, but then the part has all of the tell-tale indications that its from the same place where they also manufacture the economy version that's exactly the same as the mid-range, as the name brand. Its more difficult to tell with lubricants, but I'll see the same marks from intrusion molds, the same wiring on electrical parts with the same undersized wire gauge, and so on of all of those manufacturing fingerprints. I know that my truck has run so much better with the RP that I'm using now and I've started a plan to do another change or two with the RP and will hope to see the clarity improve. I do want to replace the oil pan and windage on the next change. Hopefully I can get the pan off without actually hoisting the engine. I saw a fairly simple method where the bar is removed that runs across the pan instead of lifting the engine.
I'm also planning to drain and check out the differential for any damage. I don't suspect anything, but the truck has 215k and it's probably time to give it an inspection.
If you can't tell, as a youngster, I worked on aircraft in the Navy and I'm all about preventing problems because failures make planes not fly anymore, and that's very bad if they are in flight when they fail.

 

[Burla]

I chatted with Bob many times, he was literally the best of BITOG imo. He has nothing to do with that place he has been gone close to twenty years and the next owner is dead, and now the owner is Mia and the inmates are running the asylum. I am starting to think the syn thread is about to be punked again.

 

[Treburkulosis]

Hey @Burla PUP and Biotech has kept my wifes 3.6 Jeep Running quietly. It has not rattled in over a year. Biotech is some great stuff. I added it yesterday to my brand new LSX 408 for peace of mind.

 

[Burla]

Hey @Burla PUP and Biotech has kept my wifes 3.6 Jeep Running quietly. It has not rattled in over a year. Biotech is some great stuff. I added it yesterday to my brand new LSX 408 for peace of mind.

.Awesome I went to 5w30 in the rav 4 and it also removed rattles, maybe I should have went biotech instead.